grit size of red rouge powder

[botticelli1972]

I was wondering, does anyone know what the grit/micron size of dry red rouge powder is? A brief google search gave too much to search through. The reason I ask is that I have seen graded diamond belts for expanding wheels for wet lapidary work that are 50,000 grit which is 1/2 micron size. I have really begun to hate the cotton/flannel wheels and loose compounds that make such a mess. I was thinking a slow speed wet wheel would make the hard part fun again-Larry

[Andy Stockton]

I found this link which was useful: http://www.ganoksin.com/borisat/nenam/buffing-material.htm;and contained this reference:Particle sizeGetting information on particle size is very difficult. This is understandable as this is one of the differentiators between polish quality companies. One company sells three different green rouges. There may be different materials added to each or most likely there is a difference in the chrome oxide quality and quantity. A smaller micron size being one indicator of higher quality. This makes it tough on us purchasers since we don’t have the information. I was able to get information from one company’s web site on particle sizeCOMPOUND MICRON SIZERed Rouge 3.5 to 5Cerium Oxide 3.5Cerium-R Oxide 1.2But my understanding from this and several articles is that particle size and consistency vary considerably between manufacturers. That is why costs vary so much. If a manufacturer doesn’t certify the size, you don’t really know what you are getting.

[drdag]

slightly off the question, I just read that if you do not use a dedicated finishing mop that you will get small scratches from the glue that they use to bind the centre…interesting, I have mops that scratch and others that dont, that appear the same, now I know why.

[jdanforth]

Has anyone tried Zam?

I’ve found the materials from Caswell to be acceptable. I used to use Dialux which is very highly regarded but I’m not sure why I switched. Perhaps it’s time to pick up some Dialux stuff again.

[botticelli1972]

The whole reason I started thinking along this line is that lately I just have not been getting a good polish, and it is getting quite annoying. When I first started I had a small converted 3450 RPM bench grinder and two wheels, one fine muslin and one canton flannel, and some rouge sticks and things were great. I didn’t even bother with hand finishing, it was not necessary they would come out perfect. I am beginning to think I just have too many toys now and cannot keep track of what works and what does not. I now have two buffers, one slow and one fast, and enough wheels and different compounds to fill a trunk. My biggest problem right now is getting tinny pits all over the plates. I make so few dags a year that the time I have to work on it needs to be successful. Last night I decided to go back to the basic set up and it seems to have helped but I still am getting some pits, they are more problematic than the faint polish lines from the final buffs.

Right now I only have Domet flannel instead of Canton flannel for a final wheel, I think even though the Domet is said to be the softest, I prefer the Canton. I think it left less lines. Could this be the source of the pits?

Has anyone tried a chamois final wheel? How about one of the hard leather covered wood wheels?

-Larry

[photolytic]

Larry,

If I may be permitted a bad Daguerreian pun here it sounds as if you’ve been spinning your wheels.

High speed rotary polishers are fine for getting off lots of material but they do a lousy job of getting out the fine scratches. Regardless of the softness of the buffing wheels or the fineness of the polishing agent they tend to leave a lot of polishing lines on what looks like a mirror finish. Yes, I’ve even tried the chamois leather buffing wheels and they tend to scratch also.

Charlie Schreiner once said that applying too much pressure on the rotary buffer actually gouged out particles of silver, creating pits on the surface, and I agree with him. I have found that repeated passes on the rotary buffer, applying less pressure with each pass, reduces the tendency to pit the surface.

I used to rely on hand buffing to complete the finishing job but while it does remove many of the fine scratches created by the rotary buffer, fine linear scratches remain. I’ve tried soft "Brain tanned", buckskin pads but they scratched too. I’ve even tried space age, nanometer size, rouge developed for solid rocket fuels, but the particles were so small (3 nanometers) that they absorbed water from the air, smearing the plates.

After seeing Irving Pobboravsky polish his plates, I finally started using a Random orbital buffer.
On July 15 under the "polishing silver" I posted the following;

Most Daggers use Bosch model R5013 5" sponge applicator pads currently available at toolsforless.com for $11.80/each. They attach to most 5inch Random orbital polishers via a hook and eye (Velcro) pad on the back. The front is a rigid polyfoam pad. For fine polishing, I cover the pad with velvet by sewing it to the pad with heavy thread. Some use this system for preliminary wet polishing of Dag plates with fine alumina powder. I prefer to use a high speed jeweler’s wheel polisher to remove the deeper scratches. I follow this up with a Random Orbital polish with rouge, and then lampblack, and finally a buff with a clean pad to remove all polishing powders.
When the velvet gets too dirty cut it off the pad and throw it out.
Velvet is not water washable and you’ll never the grit out.
A good source of silk velvet is http://www.thaisilks.com. They sell 54 inch wide bolts of natural white, 18% silk/ 82% rayon velvet for $17.90/ yard which works well. Alternately they also have 100% silk velvet, 54 inches wide for $36/yard.photolytic

I know it is frustrating when you have a limited amount of time to devote to your Dagging, but even some of the most experienced modern Daguerreotypists have said that their Dags come out perfect only about 30% of the time. Only by repeated attempts to perfect your plates will you learn what your true potential is.

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